| Title | : | Gods and Fighting Men: The Story of the Tuatha De Danaan and the Fianna of Ireland |
| Author | : | |
| Rating | : | |
| ISBN | : | 0901072370 |
| ISBN-10 | : | 9780901072375 |
| Language | : | English |
| Format Type | : | Paperback |
| Number of Pages | : | 360 |
| Publication | : | First published January 1, 1902 |
Gods and Fighting Men: The Story of the Tuatha De Danaan and the Fianna of Ireland Reviews
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This book is responsible for a lot of things: For me becoming a professional storyteller, for me falling in love with Irish legends, and for me having an English vocabulary that is mostly full of terms for Iron Age weaponry and strangely spelled Gaelic names. There is really no other way to write a review of this book - it is one of the classics that has earned a place for itself on the shelf of every person that goes anywhere near Irish lore and mythology.
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Gods and Fighting Men - The Story of the Tuatha De Danaan and of the Fianna of Ireland is an amazing collection of tales from the Mythological and Fenian cycles of Irish mythology, collected and translated and pieced together by Lady Augusta Gregory, in 1905. This is the only book still in print that I know of that contains the bulk of these tales, most written down between the 8th and 14th centuries. Like all the old Irish myths, they are centuries older than their first written appearances, coming from long lines of oral tellings and blending over the years. Besides a couple of the mythological tales that I have read in other books, all of these stories were new to me.
Some stories have been condensed, some passages in a few were left out, and in some cases different versions of the same story had their parts fused together to make a more complete or coherent tale. Generally, though, it appears that these stories in the form seen here are true to the source material, often derived straight from it or from authoritative translations of it. The style and presentation of each story feels as though it was pulled straight from the vellum, unchanged and untouched by modern hands aside from translation. The authenticity enhances the enjoyment tenfold.
One of the many reasons Lady Gregory chose to publish this collection was to preserve the traditional literature of Ireland in all its antiquity and beauty and wonder. And another reason was to make it available to a wider audience who did not have access to the obscure journals that were, at the time, the only places these translations might appear.
At the time she put this collection together, there was a consensus of ignorance in the academic community regarding Irish mythology, in which certain clueless professors made public remarks about Irish myth lacking the polished idealism and imagination seen in ancient Greek or Roman or medieval French mythology. Today we know anyone saying such a thing couldn’t be taken seriously, but these were the days before the rich cauldron of surreal, magical otherworldly mythology of the Celts was widely available. Lady Gregory published this to correct the record.
Irish mythology has been the only mythology I’ve read that, after a few of its tales, has left me with a sinking feeling in my heart, like I just witnessed something beautiful and sad and heroic all at the same time. These tales incorporate a wide array of ideas and elements. And many have a way of being gut-wrenching and tragic while also being so full of outstanding adventure and imagination and character that it defies words to adequately get it across.
This collection of myths and legends from medieval times transports one directly into a magnificent, ancient world of enigmas, enchantments, folkloric charm, heroic happenings, staggering inventiveness and artistry that is unlike any other people’s body of literary traditions. Irish myth is a wholly unique cultural development, a world of its own.
The book is in two parts, the first on the Gods, with tales from what is today called the Mythological Cycle, and the second on the Fianna, tales that are today grouped together as the Fenian Cycle.
The first part tells the stories of the coming of the Tuatha de Danaan to Ireland, the ancient people who were said to have come from the sky in the north, in heavy mist. These people had immediate conflict with the Firbolg, the residents of Ireland at the time, and wars erupted, ending in the defeat of the Firbolg. The Tuatha de Danaan possessed powers that set them apart from the later races, like the Gaels who later came to populate the country. In time, the Tuatha became the gods, and after their battles with the Gaels, lived under the earth, in the Otherworld.
The tales of this section deal with all manner of old Irish gods and characters, such as Lugh of the Long Hand, a sort of warrior-king-god. One of the longest tales with him at the center is known as “The Quest of the Sons of Tuireann”, a terrific, adventurous, and ultimately heart-breaking tale in which Lugh sends three brothers on an impossible quest after they murder Lugh’s father.
There is The Dagda, a Druidic being who seems to be the wise elder, the sage whose wisdom guides many of the Tuatha de Danaan.
There is Angus Og, or Angus the Young, associated with youth. One of his foster sons (fostering was central to Irish culture) was the hero Diarmuid, who appears as one of the Fianna in the Fenian cycle, and as a central character in a cycle of stories. Angus repeatedly must rescue him from hopeless circumstances, using enchantments and powers of illusion.
The great sea-god Manannan, ruler of the Land of Promise, has a hefty section of tales about his exploits, including his many travels throughout Ireland and his run-ins with various people whose impending adventures become the subject of many a saga. “The Voyage of Bran” is one such story, an incredible saga of a man’s epic quest to the Otherworld, poetic and dreamlike and vivid with imagination and the fantastic. And an equally impressive saga called “His Three Calls to Cormac”, or “Cormac’s Adventure in the Land of Promise” tells a tale with a similar premise, with Manannan setting an individual on an adventure into lands unknown, but following a completely different development.
Some of the best known of the tales from this section are the tales of the battles of Magh Tuireadh, decisive battles between the Tuatha de Danaan, first against the Firbolg mentioned earlier, and next a rebellious battle against the oppressive Fomorians, who legend has it moved to live in the sea after they were defeated. Another of the most well known is “The Fate of the Children of Lir”, a spellbinding story of evil and hate and death and very long life and transformation into animals.
The Fenian stories make up about two thirds of the book, and every one of them was new to me. These are amazing stories of amazing feats, excellent adventures, and filled with timeless heroes who transcend storytelling mediums.
These are tales of the Fianna, valorous warrior bands spread throughout Ireland, not loyal to any kings, but who freely hunt the lands and defend the country from invaders. Finn Mac Cumhal is the warrior-king of the Fianna, and many of the tales are about him directly, from his childhood of early heroic deeds all the way through his old and gray years, his various wives or loves, and his countless violent and exciting adventures.
The story of how he became king of the Fianna, displacing Goll, son of Morna, is one of these tales from his childhood. Finn comes to a feast with the Irish king, after his father, Cumhal, previous king of the Fianna, has been killed by the sons of Morna and replaced by Goll. One of the Tuatha de Danaan, Aillen, has been coming to this area each year at Samhain playing his dulcimer that puts everyone to sleep, after which he breathes fire over the lands, destroying everything. The king of Ireland says that whoever can stop Aillen will have just rewards. Finn, as a twelve year old boy, uses a spear given him by Fiacha, another of the Fianna, to slay Aillen. He then decapitates him and brings the head to the king. This impresses the king so highly that he lets Finn take Goll’s position as ruler of the Fianna. Goll chooses to serve him instead of leaving the land.
Other tales involve Finn's closest men of the Fianna, like his son Oisin, who is a central person in many later tales from this cycle, as the last surviving Fianna; his grandson Osgar; Fergus of the True Lips, gifted with sight of the future and esoteric knowledge; Conan and Goll, both sons of Morna, who was responsible for Finn’s father, Cumhal’s death, but who are still part of his band; Caoilte Mac Ronan, nephew of Finn, and a storyteller and warrior; a man known only as Lughaid’s Son, gifted with magic; and Diarmuid, grandson of Duibhne, among the most powerful warriors after Finn, and a man who becomes the object of a manhunt (and a brilliant cycle of violent, heroic, poetic, beautiful and sorrowful stories) after he runs off with Grania, who is to be wed to Finn.
The Diarmuid and Grania saga, by the way, is thought to have been influential to the Tristan and Isolde legends, which in turn were thought to have influenced Shakespeare's creation of Romeo and Juliet. Diarmuid and Grania’s story, however, is much more steeped in the stuff of legend and grand, bloody, magical shrouds of raw epic power than Romeo and Juliet.
Many of the tales here deal with all of the Fianna together as a whole, and tell of their epic battles, like the Battle of the White Strand (also known as Ventry, or Cath Finntraigh), or the many struggles against invaders from other countries and the sons of kings who were slaughtered, sometimes the kings themselves who were slaughtered, and the countless armies that fell to the Fianna. Decapitations and impalements and slaughter are recurring elements.
Each of the prominent characters of the Fianna are themselves significant works of legend and storytelling, taking shape in full character over multiple stories, letting us see who and what they are. Together they are a mighty band of warriors, capable of enormous feats and fighting and destruction and poetry and music. The hunting hounds of the Fianna, particularly Bran and Sceolain, are another constant, with their origins told in an early tale about the transformation of humans into beasts.
One large section of stories deals with enchantments and the bizarre, surreal, dark magic and fantastical world of ancient Ireland, filled with mysteries, odd creatures, spirits, mesmerizing music, cruel druids and sorcerers, giants, shadows and beasts and shape shifting entities. These stories alone provide enough mind-bending trips into the wholly surreal underworld of Irish myth to build an entire library on. And when you pair these amazing tales with the fact that you’ve come to know the characters well and have developed a full appreciation for their personalities and abilities and essence, the unfolding of the stories becomes more profound.
The final sections tell of the deaths of many of the core members of the Fianna, as in the battles of Cnoc-an-aire, the Hill of Slaughter. Place names, again, play an interesting role in these myths. It is genuinely sad to read the final tales, as Fianna die in either heroic or dismal circumstances, or the Fianna turn on one another, and even their hounds, who we get to know through many of the myths, die and are hinted at being reborn. As the Fianna are worn away and killed off in their final battle, very few are left. And of these, one is Oisin, son of Finn. And he is later taken away by a mysterious woman who comes from beyond the sea, taking him away to live among immortals, in a world of plenty and perfection. Finn is heartbroken that he will never see his son again, and that the Fianna have withered into nothing.
As if this climax and ending is not hard enough on the heart, Oisin comes back centuries later, driven by his desire to see his father again and the rest of the Fianna. But he returns to a very different Ireland, during the time of Saint Patrick. As his wife in the distant land warns him, if he steps off his horse once he is back on Irish soil, the horse will leave him and he will quickly age to become a very old man, and he will never be able to go back to the land where people never die and everything is wonderful. This happens to him. He has returned as a tall, towering elderly hero to a changed world, whose inhabitants are small in stature compared to him. As I learned from the introduction to another set of Irish myths, disparities in the size of people is an indicator of one belonging to an older time, with those from the ancient times towering over those of the modern world. Oisin is weak and old, and he is taken to the house of St. Patrick who is eager to hear his stories of the ancient Fianna and of Finn, but who is even more interested in baptizing him and converting him. And he is not concerned with serving Oisin his hero’s portion of food or drink.
They argue for a long time. Oisin is defiant and laments the loss of the Fianna, the loss of his father, he praises the way things were and notes the high character of all those he knew and loved. Patrick, however, berates him and tells him the Fianna are all burning in hell, especially Finn. Oisin cannot tolerate this, and the book closes with his poems and lamentations, praising the days of old Ireland and the Fianna, and dreading the new Ireland and its church bells and clerics, whose music is nothing like the music he remembers. -
Maebhdh, Queen of Connaught
Irish Mythology is a strange and elusive beast.
The stories we have gained from Irish mythology from the Cuchulainn the Hound of Ulster, the love story of Diarmuid and Grainne to the Children of Lir have come to us from ages past are haunting and beautiful but have often been reshaped and refashioned to suit Christian beliefs and deny their pagan roots. The result of which is that Irish myths often have two forms, their original bloodier pagan beginnings and their softer more moralistic and Christian retelling. This has left scholars of Irish myths in a twist; the only surviving records of the Irish mythic cycle were written by priests and monks who often transformed the myth to better suit Christian tastes and ignore its Celtic pagan roots although its older incarnations have survived in the hands of others.
However, in her own translation from old Irish legends and myths, Lady Augusta Gregory, a renowned Irish folklorist and dramatist, followed down the route of the Christianised Irish myth. She chooses to more or less follow the well-worn path of the Irish monks and scribes determined to remember Ireland's pagan past with a deliberate Christian twist. While such a retelling of Irish myths is understandable given the historical and social context under which Lady Gregory was writing, it does leave the reader with certain amount of exasperation and annoyance given the clear shoehorning of apocryphal Christian beliefs and the appearance of St. Patrick into Irish myths that starkly predated Christianity. Indeed, this retelling of the Irish mythic cycle is a product of its times which made at times difficult to enjoy.
The book is a long, arduous one at 540 pages. It details in drawn-out, doleful and meandering renderings the tales of the Children of Lir, the legend of Finn Mac Cumhaill, the love of Oisin and Niamh, the legend of Etain and Midir and the famous Ulster cycle of Cuchulainn, Queen Meabhdh and the fight for the Brown Bull of Cuailgne. It is a well-researched and intricate recitation of all the most famous stories from Irish myths, one that has been clearly written by someone deeply interested and impassioned by the old legends of Celtic Ireland.
However, while at first this book was enjoyable and exciting to read, as time wore on it became increasingly harder and more difficult to engage with overall as the writing style and the authors habit of long, unbroken soliloquies became more tedious and reoccurring. The writing style veered from old-fashioned and stilted to sombre and ponderous. This made the book a trial to read sometimes especially towards the end and its overall seriousness heavily impacted the flow and pace of the book to its detriment. It’s very solemn, passive and stiff book, one that can become tiresome and meandering. One wonders if the translation from Old Irish and the time period in which Lady Gregory was writing in had a greater impact on her writing style than she intended. Indeed, this book proved a challenge to read and I'm no stranger to older, more out of date books. Personally, i think that anyone who isn't used to early modern books and their writing style will have a hard, frankly difficult time reading this.
That being said, if you can understand and appreciate the writing style which can be quite eloquent at certain times, there is a great deal to like in Lady Gregory's Complete Irish Mythology. It can be an interesting, wistful and sombre read if you are in the right mood or interested in learning more about Irish mythology.
However, readers unfamiliar with early modern writing and intricate, hard-to follow plots and characters might find this a troublesome and infuriating read if not prepared. Can be quite difficult to get through for a general or casual reader.
3/5 Stars. -
It's always weird to read a book that's essentially a twice-over translation. First the original author translated the myths to English, and that was over a hundred years ago... and then the Polish translator, while trying to keep the archaic and mythical sound of the original, translated it into Polish... it's not always an easy read.
However, it does give a good glimpse into what the dark ages Irish could've valued and what stories spoke to them the most. While it was a bit of a struggle to get through this one, I'm not sorry I did. It earns a slight recommendation if you're into mythology and legendary tales, but can otherwise be skipped in favour of a more abbreviated version of the same stories. -
Very important cultural stories but a somewhat boring presentation. I think these myths and legends could do for a modern update in terms of syntax.
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"Gods and Fighting Men" represents Lady Gregory's effort to gather the scattered, disparate tales of the Mythological and Finnian cycles of early Irish lore, and to present them in a more or less coherent format, much as she did with with Ulster cycle in her "Cuchulain of Muirthemne". Unlike that earlier work, however, many of the stories included herein stand on their own, and this book therefore gives the impression of a miscellany rather than an epic.
Gregory's priorities, as is well known, had less to do with dispassionate scholarship, and more to do with fashioning a national cultural heritage in the light of her support of an independent Irish state. As such, her focus is providing a literary treatment that is peculiarly Irish.
To this reader in the early-21st century United States, her renditions have a peculiar flavor that is more idiosyncratic than lyrical or literary. Her stylized grammar tends to be somewhat opaque, and it doesn't always scan.
Here's a sentence chosen nearly at random:
"And they were not long there till they saw a young man, quiet and with pleasant looks, coming toward them, and he wished them good health, and they answered him the same way."
You can see there's a kind of loping quality to the construction that makes it a bit difficult to parse. Does it add to the poetic effect? Readers must judge for themselves, but I thought, not so much.
My go-to edition for this material is Cross's "Ancient Irish Tales," which is a bit closer, and a bit less mannered. -
This is fantastic mythology. I love ireland and anything irish and despite that, I would have love this book anyway because this type of mythology has amazing aspects and elements I haven't read before. There's something about the irish style of storytelling and stories that have been passed down, something in the history of that place I think should appeal to most readers. There's something fantastical and fantastic about this book and I recommend it to everyone.
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Gregory's versions of the myths are written with the music that can be missing from more recent tellings, rather in the same way that the Good News Bible loses the lyricism of the King James. Her arrangements are more demur than Kinsella's, but this is part of their charm.
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Unpronounceable names, shape-shifting, fighting, profound oaths, fighting, magic cauldrons, fighting, hunting strange beasts, even more fighting, and all rounded off with a rejection of Christianity. What more do you want?
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By far, the most comprehensive collection of tales from the Mythological and Fenian Cycle that I have found. Unfortunately, it is a jumbled mess and not very well translated. For example a sentence will be as follows: Nuada said, "We are all here," he said. That is a slightly comical mock example but the translation is bad enough that it can be quite hard to follow at times. The language certainly does not flow. They will also bunch several people's dialogue into a very long paragraph further added to the lack of clarity.
Not just that, the narrative occasionally careens forward in time and back inelegantly. For example, there are several biographies of the Tuatha de Dannan plopped in the middle of the book that follow their various career highlights much further than the narrative was at currently. I have read a lot of the sagas from different cultures. They certainly can be confusing at times. I found this to be the messiest of anything I have read. It really is a shame too because Lady Gregory certainly was a great champion of these stories and the actual stories are great. You can read some of these stories in other books and see that for yourself. I really think a properly written translation presented in an organized fashion would really benefit this story significantly. -
Lady Gregory's collection of tales was my introduction to both the Fenian and the Mythological Cycles of Irish lore. It was very readable, with a delightful prose style grafting Irish syntax onto her English translation of the originals. Various original collections were only available in Irish at the time she wrote, and her translation attracted admirers such as American president Teddy Roosevelt and Irish poet WB Yeats, a friend and collaborator of Gregory's, who wrote the introduction to this volume.
My only reservation about the work is a question how much the flavor of the work changed by a prose, rather than poetic, interpretation of the early lays and ballads passed from hearth to hearth for nearly 1000 years before other poets codified the works.
"Gods and Fighting Men" has only whet my appetite to read more of these fantastic stories. -
I’ve been looking for an understandable version of Irish mythology relating to the Tuatha De Danaan and the Fianna. I tried more modern versions, but this Lady Gregory classic is the best so far. Highly recommend.
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This is the same book as Irish Myths and Legends, just converted to a digital format.
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Un poquito pesada la lectura, pero no es una queja.
Mi parte favorita ha sido el ciclo de los Fianna, son relatos muy bellos. -
Excellent book for anyone interested in Irish mythology.
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Got a whole lot of myths, but I would suggest going into this book with a general understanding of Irish mythology.
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Can I love the stories while at the same time acknowledging that the book is a product of the Romantic nationalism of its era, and shouldn't be taken too seriously?
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This books was instrumental in understanding the popular culture view of ancient Irish legends. People in Ireland are more likely to have ready Lady Gregory's version than more scholarly ones.
I did get the strong impression reading these that this was something quite different from normal Western Culture fairy tales. Mostly because the tales did not follow an expected "normal" narrative path, and that "fairly tale logic" did not apply.
For example, one long tale about the "Hard Servant", who tricks Finn and goes off with a bunch of his men, stumbles through a number of things Finn has to go through to get him back. But after a few of these, the narrator says that he eventually got justice from the Hard Servant but the details are too boring to tell.
And the overall arc of the Finn saga is clearly the muse of depressing Irish playrights. After some normal, glorious heroic tales, there is the whole Dermott and Finn spat, where Finn becomes, more or less, the bad guy. Then later he becomes more petty in dispute with the Sons of Morna. After than the Fianna are, basically, a bunch of old men with nothing left as no one respects or honors them anymore. The tales end with a fast forward to the future where Finn's son, back from the land of the ever-young, engages in a series of petty arguments with Saint Patrick.
This isn't a Greek Tragedy, where a hero's fate rises, until he is brought down by his own hubris, only to learn his lesson and be an example to all in the end. This is probably what many of those Greek Tragedies started out like; vague disconnected folk tales, that over time and repetition were honed into a consistent and exemplary tale. Irish literature was not so fortunate.
Maybe I'm just being ethnocentric here. But I think the general problem is the ethnicity that could appreciate these tales for what they are is long dead. I think only scholars have a hope of that now.
Nevertheless, I'll probably read the rest of her books. If only because my child constantly demands more and more tales of Ireland... -
though I have read most of the tales dozens of times over, I had always wanted to read this collection. I was excited to start, but after weeks of scattered reading I finally had to give it up. This is such a disorganized rendering of these tales I just couldn't follow it - and that's saying a lot for someone who *already knows these tales*. I don't know if it was the fact that I was reading it via ereader - as i've found it is much, much harder for me to follow, and retain via an ereader than an actual book, or if it was a combination of that and the language. I just found this so scattered and incohesive, with over exaggerated language, usage and run on sentences that cover half a dozen topics / people/ places all in one thought process that span entire paragraphs and excerpts. This is just plain bad writing. There are hundreds upon hundreds of stories or anthologies written in this same era, and earlier, that retain their original language paired with romanticized lyricism that are beautiful and amazing works of visionary word. I feel like this is what she was trying to capture, but did not fully understand it - and therefor left the collection empty, hard to navigate, and just plainly confusing and hard to read. Perhaps one day I will pick up a hard copy of this book, and try again with a physical copy in hand. Perhaps that will make all the difference in the world...but until then, absolutely no. I cannot finish this. It is not worth the time nor the headache, especially when there are so many other wonderful presentation of these tales.
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This set of Irish tales reminded me of
Grimm's Fairy Tales. Barely organized; mostly miscellaneous. Several seemed to cover the same ground over and over to feel repetitive.
Some things seemed out of place like mentions of God or the Greeks. Pretty sure these are stories about events prior to Christianity came to Ireland. And the Greek presence seems even less likely.
Apparently the favorite animal to change someone into or hunt are pigs. They show up in several stories. Others like deer or hounds show up, but the pigs were notably everywhere.
I enjoyed
Táin Bó Cúalnge much more. -
This is still my go to book for research on the Mythological Cycles.
While it doesn't have EVERY story, it has so many more than I've found in any other compilation.
Her notes at the end of each book makes it so easy to follow on for more research if you are not satisfied with what she's compiled.
And for anyone who is interested, the final sequences with Oisín and St. Patrick are absolutely brilliant. It summarizes how a lot of people felt about the stories being altered by the Church and I would love to share a high five with Lady G. for this text. -
Blame my fascination with this mythology on Game of Thrones. I downloaded this book off the Internet and have been having a grand old time just working through it slowly. The stories, which range from the account of how the Tuatha de Danaan came to inhabit Ireland to the classic tales of Finn McCumhal and the Fianna, are rowdy, blustering, bawdy, mysterious, tragic accounts of how the old magic served and betrayed the fabled folk who once inhabited the Emerald Isle. Utterly addictive.
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I enjoyed this book, though the tale of Cuchulain is more interesting. This story shows you the mythological history of Ireland, starting with the arrival of the gods and ending with the return of the last of the Fianna to a christian Ireland.
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With some difficulty, I made it through this good foundation on Irish Myth. Being of Irish descent, it seemed a shame to me that I knew little about the mythology of my ancestors. Now, I feel a little better versed, although I feel the book might be due a second read sometime.
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Only a few pages in, but I love her beautiful use of language.
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Available legally and free at Project Gutenberg:
http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/14465
